Tannoy & VAC in an old-world loft

by mulveling on Ever EvolvingDone For Now

Description

** UPDATES Sept 2019
Koetsu Blue Lace with Diamond Cantilever is the BOMB. Unambiguously the best cartridge I've ever heard. The diamond cantilever raises detail, speed and dynamics of Koetsu to a next level, without pulling it towards analytical. In fact, this change actually allows MORE of the famous Koetsu musicality to pour through the speakers. Added in March of this year. Mounted on the FR64S (this arm is now clearly superior to the Graham Phantom Supreme for Koetsus). I've also switched my SUT to the Choir Audio unit based on Hashimoto HM-7. My EAR MC-3 and Koetsu SUT (pictured here atop the VAC) also sound great with the Blue Lace, but the Hashimoto sounds HUGE with lifelike dynamics. Another change is rolling tubes in the VAC phono: 1 pair Mazda 12ax7 chrome plates (my favorite), 1 pair RCA black plates 12ax7, 1 pair Mullard reissue 12ax7 - this results in a tonal balance similar to the stock tubes, but with enhanced detail, 3D imaging, and bass impact. If it weren't for my need to closely track the stock tonal balance (because that works well with my system), I'd have all 6 Mazda chromes in there - and the Mullard pair is there because it's warm enough to counter the Mazda's top end (otherwise, it's a serviceable but not stellar tube). Stock tubes were VAC's selected PentaLabs (Chinese) 12ax7. The latest system pic shows a Rogue RP-9 preamp on the bottom rack shelf, but I still use the ARC REF 6 as my primary preamp. I'm also back to the Shelter Harmony on a Clearaudio Universal 12" for my 2nd arm, which I try to mix in to save hours on Koetsu - I haven't been very successful at this, however! As good as the Harmony/Universal combo is (for a while I was going back & forth between this and the non-Diamond Koetsu stone bodies), the Blue Lace just takes everything to another level. 

** Updates Feb 2018
I have upgraded literally EVERYTHING since July 2017. I kept with the same general system composition; in many cases simply moving to newer model years and/or the next model(s) up. I did change from all Rogue Audio electronics to VAC & ARC for phono stage & preamp -- yes, I have to admit that was the right move for me to finally make. I've stuck with the Rogue Apollo amps, but bought the new "Dark" upgraded versions. And also bought a big-boy CMS Maxxum rack -- sayonara, Lovan!! I think I've kept like 3 power cords, a pair of AQ Kilimanjaro, and a pair of AQ Wild interconnects. Everything else is brand new. 

** Updates Sept/Oct 2016
Added a few updated photos, and posted a more detailed comment on recent upgrades. My original upgrade plans, as enumerated below, were formulated in 2010/2011. I've finally logged updates to each of these items. The core Tannoy/Koetsu/Rogue blend has always remained in place -- because it sounds awesome! I've also had my beloved Koetsu Onyx Platinum recently broken (RIP to my girlfriend), and bought a new Coralstone to console myself.

Mazda silver-plate 12ax7 have been put EVERYWHERE. A friend introduced me to this tube in 2015, and I absolutely love it. BIG upgrade over the usual suspects: Telefunken (smooth & ribbed), Mullard long-plates, RCA long black plates, RCA 3-mica 5751, GE 5751 "silver clips", etc.

I've fallen a bit sucker to the cable industry, and have been moving up in the Audioquest line (mostly silver) when I can find the right ones used. 

My headphone system has also gone crazy in the last 2 years: Stax SR-009, Stax L700, Head-amp BHSE (stocked with the ample vintage British/Mullard or Holland/Amperex EL34 on hand), Schiit Yggdrasil. Also have a KGSShv Carbon, Balanced-hev90 clone, KGST, KGSShv x2 etc. But the BHSE is the best. I also have a SR-007 Mk I, but strongly prefer the SR-009 and L700.

My (now very old) upgrade plans:

1) Tannoy Canterbury SE; their size is better suited to my room; the 96dB efficiency is also very appealing 
** UPDATE: Did this October 2012 - A VERY good move in the end, though I must admit it's very frustrating to re-tune & adapt everything for a new speaker, even one from the same line as its predecessor (Tannoy Kensington SE). The Kensington needed a boost in bass energy and some relaxation up top. The Canterbury SE needs some help coaxing sparkle/energy up top. The Canterburys simply sound HUGE, and I love it. 

2) Phono stage...perhaps a CineMag blue step-up to feed into the VAC Ren III's phono. Or, drop the VAC (as good as it is) and start from scratch. Perhaps a Hagerman Trumpet w/ CineMag blue or Artemis Labs? 
** UPDATE: Finally settled on a Rogue Ares in late 2014, after the THIRD TIME buying this phono stage, lol. Its latest revision is superb when paired with: Mazda Silver-plate 12AX7, Sylvania 1950s Black Plate 12BH7 OR Mazda Silver-plate 6189, and Bob's Devices 1131 SUT (each of these makes a BIG difference). Finally, this combo yields notably better sound than the built-in phono of the VAC Renaissance III that I loved so much. 

3) Table: Either a SOTA Cosmos or a Clearaudio Innovation Wood Compact (leaning heavily towards the SOTA due to past experiences) 
** UPDATE: Got the Clearaudio Innovation, obviously, in Spring 2014. With Graham Phantom II Supreme tonearm. Great table/arm, but not without their imperfections. And expensive. VERY expensive. Overall I'm mostly happy with this table rig, though. Added the Clearaudio ring clamp and reference weight late 2014 (way too expensive, but nice).

All setup in an old loft apartment in a commercial district with NO RESIDENTIAL NEIGHBORS!! The best time to crank the system up is midnight-5am - there's nobody within a mile! Solid, over-built late 1800s construction. No laundry hookups, no oven, no cable - but NO complaints from me for the overall benefits :)
** UPDATE: Still the same hookup :)
Read more...

Room Details

Dimensions: 21’ × 14’  Medium
Ceiling: 10’

Components Toggle details

    • Tannoy Canterbury GR
    Big Tannoys; totally rad speakers!!
    • VAC Master 300 Musicblocs
    Transformative, transcendent amplifiers. Largest single-component improvement I've heard in my life. Absolutely blows the 200iQ's away.
    • VAC Master
    Line-Stage. I never felt 100% about this preamp when paired with the Signature 200iQ's. But now paired with the Master 300 monos - oh yeah, 100% world class baby! Stunning!
    • VAC Signature 200iQ
    Stunning sound quality
    • VAC Renaissance Phono SE
    Stunningly natural, lifelike sound
    • Clearaudio Master Innovation
    Badass Turntable
    • Critical Mass Systems MAXXUM
    Crazy expensive rack, but it works as advertised, and earns its keep while looking awesome!
    • Audio Research REF 6
    Very clean, clear sounding Preamp
    • Koetsu Coralstone Diamond
    Amazing, stunning, beautiful cartridge. The Onyx Platinum is now my 2nd favorite.
    • Koetsu Onyx Platinum
    Pure. F___ing. Magic. In the midrange. Treble and bass quality are not as good as say an Ortofon Windfeld, but they're still quite good. And the Ortofon midrange is just awful by comparison to any Koetsu.
    Recently rebuilt in Japan; good as new again!
    • Koetsu Jade Platinum
    Sounds almost exactly like the Onyx Platinum, but slightly less warm and slightly more air on top. Very, very close. I keep this one in reserve.
    • Ortofon MC A90
    • Rogue Audio Apollo Dark
    Very good, very powerful tube amps.
    • Bob's Devices Sky 40
    Step-up Transformer; great match for the Koetsu Platinums.
    • AudioQuest Niagara 7000
    w/ NRG 1000 PC
    • Rogue Audio Ares Magnum
    Great phono stage, notably better than the non-Magnum Ares. Even with the Cinemag 1254 Blue SUT built-in, I still added an outboard SUT: Bob's Devices Cinemag Sky 40. Also upgraded the hell out of the mediocre stock tubes: Mazda 12AX7 chrome plates, Sylvania 12BH7 black plates. Superb match with Koetsu cartridges this.
    • Rogue Audio Hera II
    Upgraded to Hera II status. Fabulous sound, BUT NOT dead quiet (in conflict with the product description page's boast). It's a high-gain tube preamp so there is some noise floor if you have sensitivity amps and speakers like I do. I can deal with it because the sound quality beyond that is so great. I liked it better than the VAC Renaissance III line stage.
    • Clearaudio Innovation Wood
    Excellent table. A good clamping scheme is essential for any high-end vinyl rig -- and Clearaudio's clamps are excellent.
    • Graham Engineering Phantom Supreme
    The Graham Phantom Supreme arm is GREAT with Koetsu
    • Head-amp Blue Hawaii SE (BHSE)
    Exotic, beautiful, and amazing sounding electrostatic headphone amplifier for the top Stax headphones.
    • Stax SR-009
    The best headphones in the world. Requires electrostatic headphone amp.
    • Stax L700
    The best of the Lambda series. Not as good as the 009, but an exceedingly enjoyable headphone. I prefer this L700 to the SR-007 Mk I (a.k.a. Omega 2)
    • Audioquest (All analog cabling)
    WEL LP phono, WEL LP 0.5m RCA (for SUT), Fire RCA, Fire XLR, Wild Blue Yonder XLR, Wind XLR, Sky RCA, Sky XLR, Niagara RCA, Mont Blanc, Kilimanjaro (x2).
    • Sonic Frontiers Phono 1 SE+
    Fully upgraded by Parts Connexion. Awesome phono stage that's sadly becoming rarer and more unheard of by the day. Think I'll be retiring from the last few years' phono stage madness with this unit. Edit 2016: Whoops, guess I liked the Rogue Ares w/ 1131 SUT better after all. And the new Ares Magnum is even more better.
    • Phison Audio A2.120SE
    Sweet solid state power. 120 Watts/ch.
    • Phison A2.120 SE
    Solid State Class AB stereo amp, 120 Watts/ch, MSRP $12K. Sounds WAY sweeter than I ever expected a SS Class AB amp could sound, plus with killer bass! It's become one of my favorite components over the past year, and competes earnestly with my $30K VAC 200iQ monos!

Comments 147

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You have certainly been busy :-) Love the fossils in the Koetsu stone body ! Best to you intrepid explorer.

tomic601

Owner
@islandmandan 
That's awesome to hear! So glad it worked out for you. I felt kind of weird recommended him, because I haven't actually used his services yet (or any 3rd party tipper for that matter), but everything I've seen and read from him has been so impressive - and his "philosophy" is more compatible to me than the other options. I'll definitely be sending Joseph Long some nice cartridges in the future!

Crazy the DV now beats the Vermillion so much, but that's somewhat consistent with my findings that system matching is SO crucial - in the end, the only way to be sure of a synergistic pairing is to try gear in our own systems. I'm sure that Vermillion will be a gem somewhere else. 

mulveling

Mulveling,

I just got my Dynavector XX2MKII back from Joseph Long a couple of days ago. I managed to get it mounted up and aligned yesterday, and you wanted to know what I might think of Joseph Long's work. Well, I here to tell you about it.

It wasn't easy, I couldn't get it mounted back up on the Orsonic 101b it used  to be on (too many moving parts for my old stroke-affected mind and body to manage), so I took a cheap AT moving-magnet cart off an LP Gear headshell, and managed to get it mounted.

I managed to get it set up almost dead-nuts with my Mint LP set up tool, and what I'm hearing is beyond belief. It is smooth, and believe it or not, puts the Kometsu Vermilion to shame. I can't believe it either, but it is so very true.

So I would recommend you send any cartridge work to Joseph  Long without a care in the world. If he recommends a better stylus and cantilever, just do it. You'll be glad you did.

Best regards,
Dan

islandmandan

Mulveling,

Hello, I finally mounted my Kometsu Vermilion the other day, and it has blown me away. I didn't know I would ever hear LP's sound so much dramatically better than I've ever heard them before. I'm also glad to learn my analog front end is more than I knew it was with the addition of the Kometsu.

Now, in spite of the problems I caused myself earlier, I am very pleased with the purchase of the Kometsu. Thanks for your help and support!

Regards,
Dan

islandmandan

Well, it is kind of a relief I won't have to deal with the dead R/Channel or the contentious seller anymore.I'll be glad not to deal with that. All I have to deal with is the self-inflicted damage to a few of my favorite cartridges when I dropped my display case on the floor.

I've been through worse, though. Life throws all kinds of things our way we have to deal with, much of the time it's something unfortunate that happens to someone we care about deeply. This is much easier to deal with. It's just stuff.

Thanks for your support, regards,
Dan

islandmandan

Owner
Hi Dan @islandmandan ,
Well let's look on the bright side - your Koetsu is probably fine as is! Good idea to get it checked anyways. Have Joseph verify the alignment looks OK, etc. 

I'm in my 40s and already make plenty of mistakes too lol - it happens! We're human! Contact / connection quality is something I've become very sensitive to. I've seen SO many gremlins from this, especially in the analog chain where we end up having a LOT of them. If it's not causing a channel to fully drop out (sometimes intermittently), it can very easily cause a moderate L/R channel imbalance. Whenever I hear channel imbalance, I FIRST go checking all connections. I think my score so far is that the ONLY cartridge I've had with a true channel imbalance was a crusty 1980s Koetsu Onyx (before rebuild). In 30+ MC cartridges, every other one has had channel balance tighter than 0.5dB. Every time it's always been a connection/contact issue, or a bad tube.

I even had a brand new EAR MC-4 SUT with some solder detritus deep inside the Right output RCA jack (from the factory like this!) which starting causing a channel imbalance, and then an intermittent dead channel, a few months into ownership! We have to be vigilant on those physical connections. 

mulveling

Mike, I don't know how to say this, other than to say , I screwed up, big time. I know I listened to a different cartridge that night, and determined it was the Komatsu. I tried to play a cartridge last night, only to find the right channel was not working. Checked the connections on my Herron phonostage, and found the right channel was unplugged. Good thing I don't own a gun, I would've shot myself. At least my XX2MKII witll get retipped, and Joeseph will give the Komatsu a good going over.

Christ Mike, take my advice, don't get old. Bad stuff happens when you get old.
I also found out my Shure V-15 Type V cartridge is toast. I'll sent it to Joseph Long for repair as well.

It's all downhill from here.

Regards,
Dan

islandmandan

Mike, that's a very good question. The seller and and Andy Kim are close neighbors, so I feel good about not sending it there for the repair. I feel good about sending to a tech that can repair whatever is wrong with it, so no matter how it works out I'm good with it.
He can only punish me if I let him have a negative effect on me, I'm done iwith it. I'm not into self-imposed flaggellation., so no matter what, I'm ready to move forward.

Good talking to you, regards,
Dan 

islandmandan

Owner
Dan, 
That seems very odd to me. Why does the seller even care about your choice of retipper? Is there still some kind of contingency on the sale based on the damage report / findings? Are they invested in Needle Clinic in some other capacity?

mulveling

Mike, the seller is quite unhappy with my choice. I'm probably on my own with this now. It's about control. Well see what happens.

Regards,
Dan

islandmandan

Owner
Dan,
Yes, of course Mike is fine :)
I think that was a good choice. Hoping for a great outcome too! Those cartridges are way too nice to not enjoy. 

Mike

mulveling

Mike (I hope you don't mind if I use your name,  I am of course, fine either way). Anyway, I just sent my two cartridges off to Joseph Long, heavily insured broke-down equipment, but here's hoping they don't remain that way for long!

Regards,
Dan

islandmandan

Owner
Dan @islandmandan , 
Awesome! Please let me know your results. I've got a Jade Platinum that will need a retip before my other cartridges, and I'd love to send it that way if you have a good experience (like I'm expecting).

Mike

mulveling

Well, good news Mike. After calling Joseph, he just returned my call, and I am going to send him my cartridges for repair. I can't believe how fast that transpired.

So, I don't have to worry about any other cartridge restorer, and the good news is that if it is something in the coils that needs fixing, Joeseph can do that, where the other guy (we know who that is) can't do that kind of repair. Oh, I meant to add I dropped my cartridges from my dispay case, and my Dynavector XX2MKII had the whole cantilever broken off when it fell. What a disaster!

Thanks so much for your assistance!
Best regards,
Dan

islandmandan

Owner
Hi Dan, @islandmandan 
Not sure if this forum will allow it, but here's the info I have:
860-338-0153

I haven't used him personally yet - I've only had service by Koetsu Japan. However, given that's no longer available (and was very expensive when it was), we all have to look elsewhere. Over years I've heard or seen "negatives" about all domestic retippers except for Needlestein. He's also posted some absolutely amazing information on the forums here, so it's clear he knows his stuff - I've been impressed.

There are also some amazing rebuilder overseas. You might also ask AnaMighty Sound in France. They've shown some Koetsu retip work that looks EXACTLY like the Koetsu Japan work. One of the big factors in a retip is the mount type. Most retippers use a "mound of glue" on boron, which is also used by Van den Hul and Benz. It's a perfectly valid technique, but is quite different from stock Koetsu. Most of the Japanese (and AnaMight Sound) favor an interface mount, which looks much cleaner with a lot less glue. I can usually spot the "mound of glue" Koetsu retips in a sale ad's pics, even though seller doesn't always disclose this! 

Unfortunately if you have a channel out, that indicates a problem with either the coil (bad) or lead out wire (less bad). I would definitely go to VAS before needle clinic on that one. Here would be my priority list:

1. Needlestein or AnaMighty sound
2. VAS

mulveling

Mike, after thinking about it, I may inquire about using Joeseph long. How do you contact him?

Thank you,
Dan

islandmandan

Owner
Dan - also, I really doubt you killed a channel during your setup attempts. It's hard to do without opening it up. Koetsus are quite well protected. I would suspect the prior owner or retipper for causing such damage, honestly.

mulveling

Owner
@islandmandan 
Dan,
Strangely enough, I was recently in communication (on Facebook Messenger) with another new Urushi owner (not a Vermillion) who damaged his brand new cartridge during mounting. He sent it to Andy Kim, and it took a few round trips before it was fully worked again. By then, I think it had new (non-Koetsu) coils. A dead channel was ONE of the issues it came back with, after a supposed repair. I would implore you to chose someone else for service! Please! I would personally try needlestein (Joseph Long) first, then VAS. 

I'd also start to look around your area for audiophiles or dealers who might be able to mount your Koetsu as a service. Really, really sorry to hear about your troubles! Indeed, the Koetsu's boxy body obscures much of the cantilever for alignment, and some units additionally ride very low (exacerbating the problem), but the good news is every Koetsu I've seen has had good alignment agreement between the body and cantilever (ignore the brass cover plate which can sometimes be off center). Good luck!

Mike

mulveling

Mulveling,

I am sorry  to say I'm having real problems with my purchase of the Komatsu Urushi Vermilion. The problem is mostly my own doing. I found it way more difficult to mount and align the cartridge than I ever experienced before, due to my stroke I had two years ago.

I haven't had to do any cartridge setup due to the fact that all my carts were mounted on their own headshells, just set the tracking force, and go. After much difficulty, I got the Komatsu mounted, and the right channel has no signal. For all I know, it's my fault, though nothing can be seen to be the cause.

I checked the cartridge leads, they're okay. Other cartridges are okay. Don't know why, got to send it to Andy Kim (that's who the owner of the cartridge deals with), but I haven't heard back yet.

I even dropped the rest of my cartridges on the carpet when the display case fell down and broke the stylus on my Dynavector XX2MKII, so nothing but problems. Looks like vinyl is a young man's game, but sometimes we don't find that out until it's too late. 

Wish me luck, regards,
Dan

islandmandan

Owner
@islandmandan 
Nice! That Vermillion is SUCH an interesting model in the Koetsu lineup. Alternating copper / silver windings, super low 0.2mV output. Definitely keep those original coils as long as possible. I hope I get to hear one someday. RIP Fumihiko Sugano :( 

I'm a late Gen X'er who for some reason has developed an aggressive bias against digital. It's been a few months since I've listened to digital media for any meaningful duration. And it's long been relegated to just the headphone setup (very nice Stax, but still). Analog is IT for me. Got a 3,000 LP collection as my main fare, but also have some ~200 needledrop albums on Maxell Type II open reel tape (7.5 IPS, quarter track) which I really enjoy - these combine the sweet warmth of tape with most of the sound quality from a good vinyl setup. I'm not going to do the $400 audiophile reel tapes. That's just crazy. I enjoy the warmth of tape just fine from my non-audiophile small collection and vintage Pioneer RT909 deck. Not gonna get into those exotic tube tape amps and 15 IPS tapes, no sir! lol

mulveling

Mulveling, I'm just a poor blue-collar audiophile, but just yesterday I bought a Koetsu Urushi Vermilion cartridge that's been well used, but well taken care of, and it's been re-tipped, but it's still a Koetsu.

Last night I changed carts to an old favorite, a Zu Denon 103 R with ESCCO mods (Art Dudley's influence), and was shocked how good it sounded, the SPH bearing has contributed greatly to how silent-playing my Garrard 401 can be. Really looking forward to hearing how the Koetsu Urushi Vermilion sounds. After 50+ years of dealing with vinyl, I'm finally finding out how good LP's can really sound. I'm loving it. 

Now, the digital system is turned on after I'm too tired to keep flipping sides. But, I'm 76 and had a stroke, so I'm glad for the opportunity to really hear what vinyl can do after all this time. 
Love it!

Regards,
Dan

islandmandan

Owner
Hi @islandmandan ,
I don't have experience with DV arms but have long admired their design. So here is my hazarded guess: it looks like a fine mate to Koetsu. What Koetsu needs is stability more than mass, IMO. I've been surprised how well my RSP worked on a friend's VPI 3D Reference arm with dual-pivot mod (the dual pivot grants the VPI stability it was lacking). I think it's around 10g effective mass; much lower than the usual recommendation.

The DV 501 has some things really working in its favor here, like high lateral moving mass and rigid bearings. I wouldn't worry about the low vertical mass. I think it would sound good and work great. Your Herron phono stage is a fine match to Koetsu as well. Go for it!

mulveling

Mulveling,

I've not had the honor of owning a Koetsu cartridge, but I'm wondering if now might be the time to change that. Do you have any idea if the Koetsu's would work with my Dynavector 501 tonearm? My latest acqusition, a Shure V-15 Type V has proven to be a great fit with my tonearm.
Would Koetsu's work out as well? Even if you have to hazard a guess, I would appreciate your input.

Thanks and regards,
Dan

islandmandan

Muleving,
Something I forgot to mention, My 3C24 amp was converted by Paul Birkeland to use 812 output tubes. That's made it a giant-killer! I love it!

Dan

islandmandan

Muleving,
If you go to my system page (The Summit), there is a photo of my DIY connection system I devised for my Tannoys.

Thanks, Dan

islandmandan

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