Description

THE ROOM BEHIND THE RACING LIBRARY

When I retired in 2000 I had nothing to do and lot s of time to do it in. I thought that music was interesting and that I’d try getting a really good system and seeing if I enjoyed listening to music. I bought a series of NAD and Onkyo receivers and amps and a pair of Dunlavy SCIV. The sound was much better than I’d heard in a system and I thought this was great. I bought hundreds of cd, listened to the masters and decided I really liked music, most music. I still don’t really understand atonal or people yelling at each other. I used to think rap was what people did on doors and tables. I’d like to keep my ignorance in place on that one.

Then one evening I was having dinner at my usual restaurant hangout and after drinking a bottle of wine with a man who lived a few doors down from the restaurant, he invited me to listen to his music system. I was stunned. He had a Levinson Amp (331) with Teal speakers and Meridian cd and preamp with silver cables.WOW! I was in love. I’d never imagined that sound from a machine could be like that. I do owe Tony a thank you, for he showed me the light. A switch truly went on for me that night. Thank you.

After about ten minutes I realized that my ears hurt. I knew it was too bright, but ZAP!

I wanted to hear that clarity, that detail and I wanted to hear it for more than ten minutes without my ears hurting.

So, out went the receivers (actually I gave them to my three children) and in came Levinson gear. Since, I’ve been through ten or so amps and a few speakers and a few cables, cd players and turntables.

I’ve learned a lot of what works and what’s smoke. In wine, everything you need to know about it is in the glass you’re drinking, right now. Nope, you don’t need to know the grape picker’s name, nor the vintner, nor the name of the town, plot or mix of fruit.

You just need to know what’s in your glass. TODAY. I suppose by now you’ve figured out that I’ve tried a few glasses of wine. Yup. I stopped guessing how many bottles I’ve participated in after the 50,000 mark. No, that wasn’t yesterday. The benefit I’ve found of getting old is that you can’t remember when you stopped remembering.

I’ve come to see audio in exactly the same light as wine. I’m interested in what works, I can hear and I can feel. Once it takes an explanation to decide if it’s there, it’s not. If it feels like the music is wrong, lifeless, brittle, bright or skewed, toss the gear that caused it.

Around 2003 I bit the bullet and flipped for the design and engineering of a room by Rives Audio. It cost me the rebuild of our home. I could not find a single contractor willing to take on the room project. They clearly were so nervous about the details that they would not do it. On August 25, 2004 the room was nearly finished and the equipment was placed in it to hear what money can buy.

It’s pretty damn good!

It’s truly the best of everything I’ve heard in equipment and design. I grant those others with similar situations that there’s may be better rooms and sound, but I haven’t been to visit them and can’t say from experience.

What stands out to me in and from my room is that it feels small. It is actually 24’7” feet long and 15’2” feed wide where the speakers are located. The ceiling runs from 9’1” to 11’6” at the peak. The walls are not parallel, nor is the ceiling with the floor. And it does feel small. I believe it a combination of the oversize chair on a platform along with the monster truck sized speakers. They are 7’6” tall and 30” deep. When I have the equipment along side the chair, there isn’t much room to get past. I think I’m going to make a change in the seating. There goes my retirement fund.

The technical side of the room is Von Schweikert VR11's, Two DarTZeel stereo amps tri-wired, EMM Labs DCC2,Emm Labs CDSD Jena Labs interconnects and speaker wires, Jena Labs with a separate electrical panel fed from the top of the main panel and a separate HVAC system with acoustical dampening. The room is a floating system by Kinetics and what you see is in fact floating on a separate floor four inches below the current floor. The walls were built on the floating floor producing substantial isolation from the rest of the house. The rooms below are treated as well. There is a lot of sheetrock hanging on our walls. Waaay too much.

Having the room designed by Rives produced a set of plans which my licensed architect reviewed and then added support for. We now have two steel beams and three wood beams supporting the floor below the floor.

Pertusson’s corollary to Murphy’s Law raised it’s ugly head and true to it, “No job is so simple that it can’t be done wrong”. In spite of excellent design, engineering and effort, neither the construction manager nor those at Rives Audio ever asked each other if the plans they were each talking about were the same. They weren’t. Rives revised the plans and the contractor did not have them. Only months into the project when it became obvious that there were differences while on conference calls, did I learn that I wouldn’t be having front bass traps and that the window was offset. The first question that should be asked between designer and contractor is, what version plans do you have?

Issues arose during construction including isolating the steel column’s and room below the audio room sonically from the audio room. One is my children’s living room and the other is the boiler room. Each has loud distracting noises in it. We used a hanging isolated ceiling in the living room to keep the psycho music and video from being heard upstairs. That works well. The boiler needs more isolation and we will build a room within the boiler room to isolate it from the HVAC for the audio room.

There are two prices to pay for huge speakers. One is the obvious lot’sa money. The other is the speakers weigh in around 1000 pounds each, come in three shipping crates and need a couple of power lifters to install. Yes, call the gym first, before ordering to insure the availability of help. Our room is in the rear of the house which puts it ten feet above the driveway with no paved smooth walk to the rear. Problem! This problem needs to be addressed. It took five hours to install the speakers between bringing the six crates to the deck and actually hoisting them in place. The bookcase you see in the pictures is the actual door to the room. It is not a very wide opening and presents problems to bring in large objects. The speaker were tuned by Albert Von Schweikert and Kevin Malmgren. They measured the room and tuned and placed them in one night. Speaker placement is not critical, but position combined with seating position produces a variety of hall images.

I still am working on my vinyl setup and there are a few small details left in the room to do.

If you’re crazy enough about audio and have the willingness and ability to make it happen, I recommend taking the plunge into extreme audio. It’s a constant amazement that such beauty can be reproduced, for me (and you too).

Bill E.

Lakefrontroad
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Components Toggle details

    • DarTZeel NHB-108
    100WPC Very Solid State of the Art
    • EMT 948
    1970 Pro Table with built in line stage
    • Dynavector XV-1S
    on order
    • SRA Ohio Classe XL Iso Base
    (2) Amp Stands
    • Jena Labs 240 Volt 5 Wire (2)
    3' used with a Tenor Amp
    • Jena Labs 240 Volt 7 Wire (3)
    Used with the Audio Aero Capitole II, Aesthetix Power Supplies (2)

Comments 199

Owner
System edited: Well, I'm back... I've been in audio hell for six months. Soon to find Nirvana. Now that I've spent my kids inheritance on the upgrads, I hope that I don't loose my hearing from the car racing. Bill E.

lakefrontroad

The wit never seems to end Mike! I love it! And Bill as you already know I am more then looking forward to hearing things when they are complete(not to mention inbetween). It is really nice to have heard the many transformations this system has gone through- every change/upgrade is one step closer.

tireguy

hi Bill, from Jonathan's description of your new speakers i am blown away.....Congradulations!!!

my 'baby' Exquisites will have a new 'big daddy'.

and from the sound of things you will have to rename your page to "Vinyl is divine, the room's sublime"

mikelavigne

Owner
System edited: The electrical problems seem to be cured for now. Our next step is the construction process. We have plans which seemed to be complete, but with the addition of 1300 lb speakers, it seems that more steel is necessary under the room. The architect should have it handled within a couple of days. It's give the money to the contractor time and wait for the end room. It's been so long that I've listened to great equipment in a terrible room that I really can't imagine what it will be like to hear real music here at home. The new speakers are essentially twin Kharma Exquisites which include two 12" woofers, two 8" ceramic mids and three diamond tweeters in a 7'x 3' cabinet weighing 1300 lbs. I suppose it's safe to say that these may have to be my last speakers, since I probably can't move them anyway. As soon as this is done it's time to start on the rebuild of the theater which is in another equal sized room. Bill E.

lakefrontroad

WOW Bill sounds amazing I can't wait to see the improvements I am sure I will hear them instantly upon entering the room. Trust me folks I know the power of Bill and his Armangnac, he can get just about anything he wants with it so be warned! Keep us all posted on the improvements(it makes me happy to know that I have all of the 'cool' toys to look forward to when I get a little older- for me that is, in the mean time I'll play with yours). Cheers! ~Timmy

tireguy

Owner
This week Richard Byrd and Chris Huston arrived on Monday to do the first inspection of my room for the design stage.
Both are clearly talented and know tons more than I'm ever going to. Richard's fun, but Chris is FUN! After a few hours of analysis and measurement, we headed off to dinner at my friends restaurant with a 1976 Hospice de Beaune magnum. Yup, I know! It's old and tired, but I figured These small town fellas get the real stuff all the time, might as well tote out the second class stuff, they'd never know. Oh yeah, while they were sketching I opened a '99 Lynch Bages blanc and I figured that Richard's eyes weren't crossed enough, so I threw out some '46 armagnac. Sure enough dinner worked out great.

Tuesday morning was a little rough. But at 7am in came Richard and Chris, the HVAC contractor and the General Contractor. The local architect was promply on time at 7:30, but she's a ton better looking than us, so that's the lumps.

The shape of the room is all over the place both on the walls, and ceiling. Almost nothing is parallel, and even that's a small area. The plan is developing and we will have the drawings by early next week. The architect has been concerned with the added weight loads of the ceiling structure and ceiling materials and the loading from 7000 records and solid wood shelving I'm planing to install in the back of the room to hold them. Oh, she wasn't positively impressed with the 550 lb turntable or the 600 lb speakers I'm waiting for. Somehow, she thinks all this extra weight of about 13,000 lbs could have a bad effect on my life style... long term. I get the feeling, we'll have some more steel in the immediate neighborhood holding up this room by next month.

The electrical issues seem to be clearing up. I was able to eliminate the ground loop by putting all the units on the same outlet. I'm having a problem with the phono stage which the manufacturer is going to work on or replace. It sounds like a tube/tubes/capacitor problem. He wasn't able to recreate it last time it was in his shop, so he'll take a different approach this time.

All the glass on the side of the room is being eliminated and a set of special double windows are being created with unorthodox glass. Sound isolation is going to be very high, but not sound deadening.

To listen to the designers talk, it's going to be the second coming of Beethoven. If I get Bernstein with Rubinstein, I'll have my $'s worth.

It's only two months from completion, here's to the music.

Bill E.

lakefrontroad

Hehe .. Im sure it does !.. well maybe not sucks !! but that's a hell of a turntable !!

I live just a country north of you..so yeah !

Matt

mzn50

Owner
Hi Matt,

You live in the neighborhood?

The Capitole sucks in comparason. But, I bet you knew that.

Bill E.

lakefrontroad

Nice setup and well thought of components ..love to hear a comparison between the Rockport and your Cap .. can I come over ? :)

well done Bill

Matt

mzn50

Owner
System edited: Change in cables and cartridge, none have yet arrived.

lakefrontroad

Owner
System edited:

lakefrontroad

Bill is a rabid vinyl junkie, any vinyl is good vinyl :) I always have to throw in my .02 ~Tim

tireguy

I don't see any in your pictures. I have ordered a stainless-steel set by Ed Soler (you may have seen his "Soler Points" on auction) which will replace the Orchard Bays on my Khorus. I should get them by the time I get back from vacation (the week of 8/19).

Please let me know if you'll be in town then - I hope to stop by if it's convenient for you (I've got the latest Dido, New Order, and Nirvana unplugged on vinyl - then again I just might have turned you off ;^).

Congrats on the system - you've got it cooking!

Arooj

arooj

I wouldn't say it Greg, I believe that you're on since we're talking about the system here and the cartridge is the vast component of the whole system; i.e. we're not resolving a room problem here but we're still right on and by upgrading the analogue(unlike any other components) will certainly improve sound.

marakanetz

Ooooops, am I off topic? Bill, truth be told, I'm not sure how you can improve on what you already have, in a meaningful way!

gregm

Mara, a Koetsu (wood, of course) is excellent, expensive & rare. A big Lyra, or a Clearaudio ref, may do your job; the latter I found more revealing & less musical than the Koetsu (am I making sense?). BUT, at least they're readily available.
I wonder, what's Detlof using now on his Goldmund ref?

gregm

To all carts Koetsu is the Queen. If I had Koetsu I would bild the system from the cartridge to the speakers.

marakanetz

You may want to consider one of the Allaerts cartridges.

ivanj

Owner
Mike,

I did call Jonathan and Tenor. I spoke with Michelle and Stephan. At first I was blowing the F7 fuse which I replaced with 5 amp fast blows. They continued to blow and when I went to bias the tubes, V7 wouldn't bias. Tenor sent me two tubes and I replaced the V7 and the F7 fuse continued to blow. SO, I replaced the F7 with the stock ceramic 6.3 amp and the V9 tube flamed out!. I guess it simply didn't have enough voltage to burn up with the 5amp fuse.

The Aesthetix head unit returned and is working without any of the noise problem I'd had.

The system sounds great and I love the vinyl.

Richard Byrd of Rives Audio should be here right around 9/1 and we should begin building by 10/1.

Marakenetz,

I am changing voltages on the Tenors in order to balance the power for noise control. That the power consumption will drop in half on each line is less important than the noise to me.

TWL,

I've got to get me one of those Ricki Lee Jones lp's I ordered the AP catalog and am waiting for a shipment of about 600 50's and 60's jazz lp's in NM condition, so, I may have to wait a little.

Audio999,

I find that the Ruby 2 is even, to the soft side, no harsh edges and very good detail and harmonic balance.

I'm thinking about the Van den Hul Colibri, although I've yet to hear it. My system can afford greater presence and intensity. It's anything but bright and edgy.

Thanks all and have a great weekend.

Bill E.

lakefrontroad

Sounds like one awesome system there, Bill! Very few of us will ever get the chance to own stuff like that. You should feel very fortunate to be able to enjoy it. Even though many like me feel like we are getting close to nirvana with our lower cost systems, most of us would love to get into a super-high-end system if we could afford it. Spin a Rickie Lee Jones album for me, would you? Enjoy!

twl

Bill, Congratulation and watta great system.
I have the Aesthetix IO Signature with twin power supply and i'm on the way to buy new cartridge.

My choice is either the Helikon SL or Ruby 2.

How do you like the Ruby 2 ? What did you have before the Ruby 2 ?

audio999

Is there big current demand on Tenor to re-arrange it for 240V?

marakanetz

hi Bill, congrats on your vinyl system finally being "right". it took me two months of messing around to get there but it was definitly worth it.

careful with the fuse problem on the Tenors. if it is blowing fuses either call Tenor or call Jonathan to make sure all is ok. it is possible one of the protection circuts has been compromised. make sure things are muted when you you turn the Rockport on and off. not necessary for cueing, just when the motor is started or stopped. a start-up pop from the Rockport "can" blow a fuse or tube in extreme conditions. if your grounding is proper (it most likely is from our phone conversation) then an extreme start-up pop is unlikely. also, mute when the Io is turned on or off; same issue. if you are carefull about these two issues you should avoid blown fuses in the Tenors.

you are going to be enjoying a lot of vinyl....have fun!

mikelavigne

Sounds wonderful Bill! Now where are your pictures?? ;)

tireguy

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