Description

Audio Note, WE-91A, Rega, Ayon
1/20/12 -I built a 300b single ended triode amplifier based on Joe Robert's Western Electric 91A. Used all vintage caps and vintage resistors-Alen Bradley and Ohmite. These vintage parts came from Leeds Radio just a few subway stops from my apartment in Brooklyn. The coupling caps are .1uf V-Cap TFTF. Large motor run oils in the power supply. Sophia Electric 91-05 Opt transformers and Sophia Princess Mesh Tubes. Stancor PT's came from ebay.

3/2012: Replaced the Alps Potentiometer with a Goldpoint 50K stepped attenuator. More clarity and transparency through the entire frequency range.

Still not using a pre amp.

5/12- Replaced the oil capacitor C-3 biasing the 6C6 with a Black Gate.

6/6/12- Finished new chassis

7/12 - Added Rega P3-24 with Power Supply and Exact Cart. Will look at different cart options later

7/12 - Pulled the 24 gauge silver hookup wire used throughout the amp and installed 16 gauge pure copper wire. The 24 gauge wire gave the sound a weightless quality that I did not like.
The 16 gauge has been in for three weeks and I can report that the weight and depth has very pleasingly improved. Vocals have an added pleasing quality. Instruments throughout the entire frequency range have more depth and richness. The low end is more powerful. I can more easily perceive the stage that the players are performing on.

10/12 Pulled C-5 and didn't replace it. Pulling this capacitor has changed the sound of this amp. Clarity and detail throughout but especially in the lows thru the mid range. Much easier to detect decay and the accompanying reverb. Dynamics seem more unconstrained as well. It has decreased gain by around 20% but in my room with the AN-e's it does not matter.

1/2013- Replaced the 1k Allen Bradley 6C6 Cathode resistor with a Vishay TX2575. This resistor is very neutral...almost as though it has no sonic character of its own. Each instrument has its own accurate color and detail but not at the expense of the overall musical message. Took about 100 hours of break in time.

2/16/13--After a month with the TX2757 in the 6C6 cathode position, including bypassing them with Black Gate Caps I decided to pull these resistors. They did not provide the richness and room filling sound that the A-B's and the older AN Tantalum did. A few weeks ago I got two of the most recent production 1k An Tants from the Hi Fi Collective.

These new Tants are more closely akin to the A-B's than to the TX2575's. They are not as sonically accurate or pure as the TX's. But they do fill the room with rich satisfying music like the A-Bs but with more detail and without the extra noise or warmth or whatever it is with the A-B carbon comps. Still running the amp without the 6C6 bypass cap.

2/2013--Built a home brew phono pre amp using the Audio Note M3 schematic.

4/2013-Upgraded to the Rega White belt and Groovetracer Reference subplatter. Excellent sonic improvement.

5/2013- WE91a amp---Replaced the the screen cap (6C6) which was an oil with a 12uf Solen cap. Have about 50 hours on the Solen. Not sure I like it. Makes the amp sound a little cold and forward. Will live with it for a while.

Late 5/2013. The 12uf Solen has broken in and I like it better than the oil that it replaced. Warmth but with plenty of detail.

Mid 7/2013 (Audio Note DIY Phono pre) ---- Added Audio Note Tantalum resistors into the signal path. 7/27/13-took out the .047 and .33uf Solen caps in the signal path of the phono pre and added .047 Vcap TFTF and .33 Audio note copper caps.

8/11/13 (Audio Note DIY Phono pre) After two weeks with the Vcaps and AN copper caps in the phono circuit my vinyl rig is a lot fun to listen to. A more beautiful and open sound than with the Solen caps.

10/12/13 WE91a---
replaced the 15uf oil cap that was biasing the 300b tube with a polarized 22uf Black Gate. Will listen for a while and see if I like it.

11/1/13 WE91a
The Black Gate by itself is still fine.

I cleaned the resistor and Cap leads, tube sockets and tube pins with 99% alcohol. They have been in the cicuit for 2 years and were tarnished and very dirty. Once cleaned much more mid range clarity and cleaner bass.

11/20/13 Added Gold Lion GZ34 Rectifiers. Sound is open and airy. Very nice

12/28/13 Added Emission Labs 300bXLS.

2/17/14- Audio Note Home Brew Phono Pre-Finished new chassis for the Power supply.
Added 8 more Tantalum Resistors (4 per channel) to the Phono circuit. Now the circuit has a few A-B's and 6 Tantalums per channel. Phono pre sounds a lot better than it did with the PRP red resistors.

3/16/14 WE91A. Because the EML300bXLS tubes are so well internally balanced, I was able to remove the Hum pots and still use AC heat. Now the 300b bias is going thru the center tap of the 5volt filament transformer. Without the hum pots, the sound is much freer and alive. I am liking this!

3/31/14-AN Phono Pre. Replaced several more PRP resistors that were on the plate of both the PS and circuit with Mills. Hopefully they will sound better than the PRP's

5/1/14 WE91a. Took out the Allen Bradley grid leak resistors and replaced with Shinkoh Tantalun resistors. took about two weeks to break in.
5/25/14 WE91a. Put the Allen Bradley grid leak resistors back in. The Shinkoh Tants made the amp have a glare that didn't go away even after the resistors were broken in.

Running the Amp at 425V B+ is sounding good with EML 300bXLS and GZ34's.

6/7/14 AN Home Brew Phono Pre-
Took out the last PRP resistors in the circuit and replaced with Allen Bradleys. Very nice change. Now the circuit has a good mix and Tants and Allen Bradleys. There are a few more PRP's in the power supply that I will replace very soon.

6/22/14 AN Home Brew Phono Pre- Took out the last of the PRP resistors in the power supply and replaced with Mills resistors

9/23/14 AN Home Brew Phono Pre - Installed Audio Note Copper Capacitors in the RIAA network. .0028uf and .0082uf in each channel

11/21/14 AN Home Brew Phono Pre - Replaced the six more Allen Bradley resistors (3 per channel) with Takman one watt resistors.

11/28/14 AN Home Brew Phono Pre - Tweeked the voltage in my phono pre. Very good results. Much more open and transparent sound. Orchestral strings sound really nice.

12/6/14 Rega P3-24. I added a Audio Note iQ3 cartridge. Needs about 100 hours of break in.
Rega Exact is a great cartridge but opportunity came up. We'll see which I prefer once the iQ3 is broken in.

12/13/14 WE91a. installed Duelund Copper Cast coupling caps. After two weeks more natural sounding than the V-cap Teflon

1/12/15-Duelund Copper CAST 630v coupler caps have a very natural, emotionally engaging musicality with a very rich and colorful tonal pallet. Keepers for sure!

3/1/15-WE91a - Experimenting with WIMA power supply caps. These are Metallized Polypropylene. C2 in my power supply is a 100uf oil. I have replaced it with a 50uf Wima. I think the 50uf is a better choice as it controls the woofer a bit better.

3/7/15- WE91a - Added new custom built power transformers by Heybour. 250mA. Also added another WIMA cap at C1- its a 15uf.
B+ went from 424 to 450. 375v across the 300b plate. 76mA. With all these changes the amp has better control over the woofer. Punchy bass.

3/25/15 WE91a. Took out the Wima at C1. Made the amp sound harsh. Put it a GE F97 oil.
3/30/15 WE91a. Took out the Solen 12uf Cap on the screen of the 6C6 driver tube and replaced it with a 22uf Black Gate VK cap. The Solen is muddy compared to the Black Gate. I didnt realize how important the cap on the 6C6 screen is to the sound of the amplifier.

4/15/15 WE91a - A friend has lent me four low DCR 2H chokes (two per channel) to try in place of the single 10H Hammond in each channel. PS is now 15uf/1.8H/15uf/2h/50uf. Amp sounds faster and more nimble. Nice.

5/14/15 WE91a. I have bypassed the Wima Cap at C2 in the power supply with four very low value film caps. Too soon to draw any conclusions about sound.
5/31/15 WE91a. New production Audio Note 50uf Kaisei Power supply capacitors have arrived and after a week of burning them in, I have installed them in place of the Wima 50uf and all of those bypass film caps. will see which I like better in a couple of weeks.

6/13/15 WE91a. The New production Audio Note 50uf Kaisei Power supply capacitors have been in my power supply for two weeks - about 100 hours or so of playing time. They have a purity, and a crystal clear clarity that no other cap in the power supply has had. I am going to replace the rest of the PS oils with these to see what happens. Maybe it will be too much- who knows. They dont have too much of a sonic signature. They just sound very free and open so adding a few more may be ok. If not I can put an oil back in.

7/10/15-WE91a. Installed Audio Note Ultra Hi B output transformers today. Will need a few weeks to come around.
9/1/15 - WE91a. The Audio Note Transformers and great with excellent depth and coherence. Added copper shrouds. 
9/25/15 -Western Electric Speaker wire and interconnects. I like the speaker wire better than my Audio Note Lexus copper. More direct. They make the Lexus cable sound soft around the edges and diffuse. The WE Interconnects are very good too. But still learning about there sound.
10/11/15 - WE91a. Took out the 6C6 driver tubes and installed C3m drivers. 

11/28/15 - WE91a. Added Regulation to the Screen of the C3m driver tubes. K&K CCS board and an OD3 glow tube that is puts out 150volts. The C3m driver tube and regulation is an excellent driver of a 300b output tube. Very fast  and dynamic with lots of detail and musicality. I am very happy with the sound of this amp.  Probably not making any more changes for quite a while.

1/1/16 - WE91a I still notice a bit of extra weight in the lower mids so I replaced the last oil cap in the power supply (c-1) with an Audio Note Kaisei 50uf cap.

2/1/16 -WE91a. After adding additional Audio Note Kaisei capacitor to the power supply, the voicing of this amplifier is complete. The power supply is 50uf/5h 30ohm choke/ 50uf and it sounds dynamic fast and clean. With all Kaisei caps in the power supply the lower mids are now more open and that weight I mentioned above is gone. Will rebuild the amp onto a new piece of wood and hide all of the hi voltage parts underneath. Will post pics of the new build as it progresses.

3/10/2016 - WE91a.  New Chassis is finished. The new build features and extremely short signal path and a copper box known as a "faraday cage" which isolates the audio circuit from RF/AC, Cell phones, and other nasty's. The goal here is to eliminate the grid stopping resistors that are usually necessary on many tube grids. In a SET amplifier any extra part effects the sound especially a resistor in series with the grid. They are usually necessary on the C3m grid as well. Without a grid stopper the C3m tube can squeal and make all sorts of other very harmful noises but with my new chassis implementation I have not needed a grid stopper.  If the C3m tubes continue to behave it would be a major step forward. The sound of the amp without a grid stopper is more open free and natural.

4/2/16 - Audio M3 Phono Pre- I had some copper left over from my amp build so I made a 8x6x2 copper box and put the phono circuit inside. Pics added.

5/16- Bought Kondo KSL-LP silver interconnects and am using them with Audio Note Lexus Bi Wire copper speaker cables. After trying various IC's like homebrew WE-16g and Ocellia silver reference and various Speaker cables like WE-16g and 10g and Kondo KSL-SPz, the Kondo KSL-LP silver interconnects with Audio Note Lexus Bi Wire copper speaker cables really bring something special to the table at least to my ears system and room.

9/20/16 Ayon CD07 - put in NOS Raytheon 5687 tubes and after a week of break in they sound tremendous. Transparent mids fast and clean lows and clean extended highs. Better than any tube thus far.

10/2016  WE91a - I removed the 91k bleeder resistor from the last cap in the power supply. I can't believe how much more open, free and transparent the sound is. It's like that bleeder had clamped down on PS and now without it there is more energy coming into the room. Any tonal warmth that had been left in this amp is now gone.

11/2016 WE91a - with the bleeder resistor removed I noticed a tinniness in they high frequencies so I removed the GE 12gauge wire from both the power supply b+ and ground and replaced it with vintage WE 16gauge wire and that tinniness is now completely gone. The WE vintage wire sounds very good just as others have reported.

1/2018 -WE91a. Replaced the Goldpoint 50k stepped attenuator with a Seiden Shunt stepped attenuator loaded with Audio Note tantalum resistors. Its been in for about a month and I am shocked at the change in sound. Extended highs and lows and more lively mids. Huge step up. The highs and mids are so open and beautiful. Powerful bass. A very worthwhile change.

3/2020- WE91a.  Over the past year and one half, experimented with a .22UF Russian vintage cap in the coupling position in place of a duelund .1uf copper cap after growing tired of the  accurate and analytical presentation of the Duelund. The Russian cap did not do anything that I liked even after a year of listening. It was kinda like all the instruments turned the color of grey. I’ve had some Audio Note copper .47uf caps sitting around for a few years so put them in around the first of 2020 so they now have three months on them. 

The AN copper .47uf coupling caps after a two month an up and down ride stopped changing about a month ago. So I’ve been listening for a solid month after they finally settled in.  

I perceive no less detail with them compared to the duelunds but the detail is integrated into a more musical and three dimensional presentation. There are real instruments playing in front of me. Much more texture and dimension. There may be just a bit of glue tying everything together but even with the glue, there is individual instrumental color and tone in spades. A bit more overall warmth and richness.  Keeping in mind that my system has AUDIO NOTE output transformers, speakers, speaker cables, resistors and capacitors, kondo interconnects and an AN IQ lll Cartridge. So I would have thought adding an Audio Note coupling cap would have been to much, but it actually brought everything together in a very nice way.

 I think they might be too much of a good thing in a system that already fills out a three dimensional space but for me they add something lovely and musical that was missing. This reminds me that there is no such thing as the best capacitor or best anything else....

Read more...

Room Details

Dimensions: 25’ × 12’  Medium
Ceiling: 9’


Components Toggle details

    • Audio Note UK Audio Note UK AN-e LX HE
    Fun to listen to speakers that do a nice job with most types of music
    • DIY WE91a
    Very natural sound amp with good pacing. Duelund Copper cast caps. Audio Note Ultra hiB Output Transformers. Very short signal path and power supply wiring.
    • DIY Western Electric WE-91A
    Old breadboard

Comments 326

Bill,
Wow! You've been busy lately with this all out assault preamp project. I look forward to your listening impressions and how it compares to the TRL Dude you have used and admired for many years.

charles1dad

Jet, are you still liking those AN electro caps? I am thinking of ordering some for my Hydrid Lector amp.

I preamp project is near completion. I am waiting on a power tranny and some voltage regulation boards. Here is what I can tell you this far.

True dual mono design with each channel completely isolated from the other. Two iec's, two power trannys, two filament trannys, two filament filters, two CLC plate supply filters feeding two separate voltage regulation boards. I am using an LDR for attenuation - Tortuga with nice linear 12v power supply. It has remote, balance, selectable input impedance, and auto LDR calibration.

All film cap power supplies with Clarity TC and GE oil type caps. Western Electric signal wire, solid core copper power supply wire from Neotech.

Premium Teflon tube sockets for the two 6sn7 tubes. Jupiter copper foil output caps. SS rectified using high quality FRED bridge rectifiers.

I hope it sounds good as I put a ton of time into this with lots of reading and learning.!

grannyring

Owner
Thanks Guys.
It was interesting over the past several weeks to hear the amp NOT making music:)

I'll add voltage regulation in a week or two depending on when I have time.

jetrexpro

Nice report Jet! I look forward to hearing what you think of the regulator for the screen voltage.

salectric

Jet,
Emotionally connecting and natural sound reproduction are what it's all about. I'm glad your latest modification project has propelled you much closer to your desired objective. I can only imsgine how good your music must sound.
Charles,

charles1dad

Owner
It's been three weeks since I replaced the 6C6 driver tubes in my WE91a 300b amp with C3m driver tubes so it's time for an update since all the parts should be broken in. For the first two weeks I suffered while all the capacitors and resistors and the tubes took their sweet time breaking in. One thing that was clear from the beginning was how much more extended the high frequencies were compared to the 6c6 tubes. Also once the sound gained some weight and gravitas that cheetah speed slowed a bit. So the amp's pacing is a bit more natural.

After about two weeks I was pretty sure the parts and tubes were broken in but the amp was not making music and sounded pinched and tentative so I pulled the grid stopper resistors and wow that stressed pinched sound went away and the sound started to come alive. Grid stopper resistors are included in many amp designs but I can say from this experience they killed the musicality of my amp.

But after a few days the amp was still not making emotionally connecting heart warming music like it did with the 6c6 drivers and I was hearing some
upper midrange glare, so after some email conversations with Salectric (thank you Salectric!!), I pulled the 5uf capacitor that was filtering the screen voltage.
Salectric thought I had enough filtering already and advised me to try pulling
it. Now this is when the amp started to cook! The highs and upper mids became extended, gorgeous and filled the room with an air and space that I had not heard before from this amp. The mids are very clean and clear but also rich musical and emotionally engaging. These C3m tubes possess a lit from within sense of refined touch and a clean texture. This is where the magic is happening and makes the 6c6 tube sound a a bit muddy and wooly by comparison. This lit from within expression extends through the entire frequency range. As I mentioned above the highs and upper mids are pretty special.

Another highlight is how clean the lower mids are. Clean but still fully expressed with weight and depth. They add to what was already happening when I added the Audio Note output transformers. Of course electrically the C3m tube is much better equipped than the 6c6 tube to drive the 300b tube.

So yes the amp is finally making expressive emotionally engaging music. There is more that I can do to the circuit that may yield even further improvement. Salectric and I have been discussing regulating the screen voltage. I've got the parts to do it. It would eliminate three more resistors and one more capacitor. Most folks who use the C3m tube employ some kind of regulation and the screen of this pentode is very sensitive and should respond quite favorably to a regulated voltage.

It took a few weeks of suffering but I am finally very excited by the level of
music making this amp is producing. The 6c6 driver tube is justly famous for its beautiful musicality that is emotionally connecting, but after some work the C3m driver can be even more beautiful sounding with even more potential for musicality and excellent coherent fidelity. Jet

jetrexpro

Owner
The C3m driver tubes have been installed for about 24 hours so I would not say anything specific about their tonal characteristics since they and some of the bypass caps are new but it is interesting to hear how different they handle dynamics when compared to the 6C6 tubes they replaced. The C3m drivers are VERY fast and very dynamic when compared to the 6C6 drivers. The C3m's sound modern and the 6C6 have a more relaxed older sound. I don't know if that is the right way to put it but at this point the amp sounds like a cheeta. This may change as the tubes and caps break in. The 6C6 drivers have a very natural slightly layed back pacing which I love. These C3m's are super speedy at this point.

Many technical guys say the 6C6 is not up to the task of fully driving the 300b and are slightly rolled of at the frequency extremes and the C3m suffers none of these technical draw backs. But the proof is in how the amp sounds and not about technical specs. More about these this coming weekend -Jet

jetrexpro

Owner
Grannyring, Looking forward to hearing more about your Electra Fidelity amp.

I added copper shrouds to my AN Ultra Hi-B output trannies about a week ago and the amp's performance has taken another step up. The extra detail on top of the other superior attributes of these trannies leaves me shaking my head at the musicality of my amp. This makes me very cautious about changing driver tubes at this time as I am loving the 6C6 driver tube.

This is what Audio Note writes about the copper shrouds:

"the copper shroud being non-magnetic improves not only RF influx, but also low level behaviour as it does not short out the airgap on the higher permeable cores like the AN Ultra HiB and the nickel cores this is essential for optimal performance."

jetrexpro

Lots of wire to compare!

grannyring

Owner
Charles, The C3m tube is also used in the Shindo Vosne Romanee. The DIY community is enthusiastic about the C3m saying it drives a 300b much better than the 6C6. Some like its sound better than the 6sn7 which you reference above. I love the sound of the 6C6 tube - so natural with great pacing so yes this will be very interesting. When I remove the 6C6 tube I will leave all the resistors and capacitors attached to it so if I end up not liking the C3m, I can reinstall the 6C6 without much trouble. Your Franks which use the 6em7 triode as a driver is one of the top 300b amps. I heard Snopro's Franks and felt like I could come home to that sound anytime!

Grannyring, I have en extra set of Switchcraft RCA plugs and some more WE16ga and will build a third set of IC's with the Switchcrafts. Eventually I'll have several IC's to compare. The shielding finally arrived so at some point I'll throw that into the mix as well. In my system the Canare F10 sound smooth from top to bottom with lots of midrange texture.

I briefly listened to the WE 22ga solid core ICs last night and they sounded closed in lacking any texture and color so they will need lots of burnin time.

jetrexpro

Jet, I still love my WE16 IC's made with Switchcraft connectors. One set shielded and one not. Perfect.

I look forward to your comments on the solid core. I guess they will sound more direct and up-front. Not as much warmth..... We will see!

grannyring

Jet,
Shigeki Yamamoto preferred the C3m as the driver tube in his 300b SET amplifiers. He didn't like the popular 6sn7 as a 300b driver, Israel Blume felt the same and instead uses the 6em7 as the driver. As always, there are alternative approaches. I'm interested to read what differences you hear between your 2 driver tubes.
Charles,

charles1dad

Owner
1markr. I don't know. Hope you got your answer.

Update WE16ga Interconnects- I have been listening to my WE16ga interconnects with Canare F-10 RCA plugs for several weeks and I like them very much. Better than the WE16ga IC's terminated with no name RCA plugs. The Canare plugs have a richer and smoother and more room filling mid range. My wife and I both heard the difference which is pretty significant. I still have not tried shielding yet.

Last night I built another pair of WE IC's using 22ga solid wire and SwitchCraft RCA plugs. Two runs of wire per positive and negative with a pretty tight twist. More on the sound of these later.

In my Western Electic 91a amp, I am a few days away from pulling the 6C6 Pentode driver tubes and replacing them with C3m Pentodes. Lots of differences. C3m tubes draw more current and have 20 volts on the filaments. Many feel the C3m pentode is one of the best sounding driver tubes for a 300b amp. I'll find out! - Jet

jetrexpro

Where does one find these Green Cactus caps? I would like to try a pair in my Dodd preamp; it contains a hefty pair of 2.2uF Mundorf Silver/Oils.

1markr

Owner
Hi Brett I tried calling you this evening could not leave a message. I messaged you through the agon system

jetrexpro

Owner
Brett I call you. With no wife to tell me what to do, the living (listening) room has vinyl and WE wire strewn all over the floor. If I know what is good for me I'll have it cleaned up before she gets back in town early next week :>)Jet

jetrexpro

Jet,
My phone crashed and all info was lost. (call me)
how is life with no wife and no strife?
Love to have her back :)

isochronism

Now you guys know that no single amp is ever the best. I actually like this Electra Fidelity better than the 845 and 300b thus far. Just more full bodied and meaty along with everything we all like about great SET amps.

grannyring

Owner
Grannyring I've heard the Abby's with a 45 amp. I bet they are being driven very nicely with those firm 11watts. Near field must be intoxicating. Charles and I were living vicariously through your 845s and are now having withdraw symptoms :)

jetrexpro

Hello Bill,
I understand your rationale for selling the 845 SET amplifier given your back problems and risk of injury to it(heavy amp to move/lift). Based on your success with it I'm somewhat surprised you didn't just declare it as your final amp and just enjoy its thrilling qualities(thus no need to move it around). However reading your many posts over the years I recognize your strong(overwhelming?) desire/curiosity to continuously try other components. Based on your description that 845 seemed like a very "special" amplifier. Best of luck with your new el34 amplifier.
Charles,

charles1dad

Jet, the amp is broken in. I wish I could hear your speakers on this amp. I may end with a set like yours. I purchased a set of Cain & Cain Abby speakers and love they way they sound with the amp. I know my Lahave speakers are "better" but I love the sound of this amp with these high efficiency single driver speaker. It has the near field 165k drivers. I sit 6 feet away or so and what an experience this is. I only paid $350 for them and I am quite pleased with the music.

grannyring

I really like the sound of Genalex reissue KT-77 tubes but my experience is limited to push-pull designs. I have never used a 12AU7 except as cathode follower so can't help there.

salectric

Owner
Grannyring is the el34 amp broken in? Great that you have both nude and shielded WE ICs. Sounds like they will both come in handy. I plan on doing the same. Haven't got around to building the shielded pair yet but will do soon. Will be looking forward to your updates. Jet

jetrexpro

Just simple JJ tubes and I will get better soon. Do you have any suggestions Salectric?

Two El34 and one 12au7.

grannyring

Granny, what types of tubes are in the new amp?

salectric

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