Description

Audio Note, WE-91A, Rega, Ayon
1/20/12 -I built a 300b single ended triode amplifier based on Joe Robert's Western Electric 91A. Used all vintage caps and vintage resistors-Alen Bradley and Ohmite. These vintage parts came from Leeds Radio just a few subway stops from my apartment in Brooklyn. The coupling caps are .1uf V-Cap TFTF. Large motor run oils in the power supply. Sophia Electric 91-05 Opt transformers and Sophia Princess Mesh Tubes. Stancor PT's came from ebay.

3/2012: Replaced the Alps Potentiometer with a Goldpoint 50K stepped attenuator. More clarity and transparency through the entire frequency range.

Still not using a pre amp.

5/12- Replaced the oil capacitor C-3 biasing the 6C6 with a Black Gate.

6/6/12- Finished new chassis

7/12 - Added Rega P3-24 with Power Supply and Exact Cart. Will look at different cart options later

7/12 - Pulled the 24 gauge silver hookup wire used throughout the amp and installed 16 gauge pure copper wire. The 24 gauge wire gave the sound a weightless quality that I did not like.
The 16 gauge has been in for three weeks and I can report that the weight and depth has very pleasingly improved. Vocals have an added pleasing quality. Instruments throughout the entire frequency range have more depth and richness. The low end is more powerful. I can more easily perceive the stage that the players are performing on.

10/12 Pulled C-5 and didn't replace it. Pulling this capacitor has changed the sound of this amp. Clarity and detail throughout but especially in the lows thru the mid range. Much easier to detect decay and the accompanying reverb. Dynamics seem more unconstrained as well. It has decreased gain by around 20% but in my room with the AN-e's it does not matter.

1/2013- Replaced the 1k Allen Bradley 6C6 Cathode resistor with a Vishay TX2575. This resistor is very neutral...almost as though it has no sonic character of its own. Each instrument has its own accurate color and detail but not at the expense of the overall musical message. Took about 100 hours of break in time.

2/16/13--After a month with the TX2757 in the 6C6 cathode position, including bypassing them with Black Gate Caps I decided to pull these resistors. They did not provide the richness and room filling sound that the A-B's and the older AN Tantalum did. A few weeks ago I got two of the most recent production 1k An Tants from the Hi Fi Collective.

These new Tants are more closely akin to the A-B's than to the TX2575's. They are not as sonically accurate or pure as the TX's. But they do fill the room with rich satisfying music like the A-Bs but with more detail and without the extra noise or warmth or whatever it is with the A-B carbon comps. Still running the amp without the 6C6 bypass cap.

2/2013--Built a home brew phono pre amp using the Audio Note M3 schematic.

4/2013-Upgraded to the Rega White belt and Groovetracer Reference subplatter. Excellent sonic improvement.

5/2013- WE91a amp---Replaced the the screen cap (6C6) which was an oil with a 12uf Solen cap. Have about 50 hours on the Solen. Not sure I like it. Makes the amp sound a little cold and forward. Will live with it for a while.

Late 5/2013. The 12uf Solen has broken in and I like it better than the oil that it replaced. Warmth but with plenty of detail.

Mid 7/2013 (Audio Note DIY Phono pre) ---- Added Audio Note Tantalum resistors into the signal path. 7/27/13-took out the .047 and .33uf Solen caps in the signal path of the phono pre and added .047 Vcap TFTF and .33 Audio note copper caps.

8/11/13 (Audio Note DIY Phono pre) After two weeks with the Vcaps and AN copper caps in the phono circuit my vinyl rig is a lot fun to listen to. A more beautiful and open sound than with the Solen caps.

10/12/13 WE91a---
replaced the 15uf oil cap that was biasing the 300b tube with a polarized 22uf Black Gate. Will listen for a while and see if I like it.

11/1/13 WE91a
The Black Gate by itself is still fine.

I cleaned the resistor and Cap leads, tube sockets and tube pins with 99% alcohol. They have been in the cicuit for 2 years and were tarnished and very dirty. Once cleaned much more mid range clarity and cleaner bass.

11/20/13 Added Gold Lion GZ34 Rectifiers. Sound is open and airy. Very nice

12/28/13 Added Emission Labs 300bXLS.

2/17/14- Audio Note Home Brew Phono Pre-Finished new chassis for the Power supply.
Added 8 more Tantalum Resistors (4 per channel) to the Phono circuit. Now the circuit has a few A-B's and 6 Tantalums per channel. Phono pre sounds a lot better than it did with the PRP red resistors.

3/16/14 WE91A. Because the EML300bXLS tubes are so well internally balanced, I was able to remove the Hum pots and still use AC heat. Now the 300b bias is going thru the center tap of the 5volt filament transformer. Without the hum pots, the sound is much freer and alive. I am liking this!

3/31/14-AN Phono Pre. Replaced several more PRP resistors that were on the plate of both the PS and circuit with Mills. Hopefully they will sound better than the PRP's

5/1/14 WE91a. Took out the Allen Bradley grid leak resistors and replaced with Shinkoh Tantalun resistors. took about two weeks to break in.
5/25/14 WE91a. Put the Allen Bradley grid leak resistors back in. The Shinkoh Tants made the amp have a glare that didn't go away even after the resistors were broken in.

Running the Amp at 425V B+ is sounding good with EML 300bXLS and GZ34's.

6/7/14 AN Home Brew Phono Pre-
Took out the last PRP resistors in the circuit and replaced with Allen Bradleys. Very nice change. Now the circuit has a good mix and Tants and Allen Bradleys. There are a few more PRP's in the power supply that I will replace very soon.

6/22/14 AN Home Brew Phono Pre- Took out the last of the PRP resistors in the power supply and replaced with Mills resistors

9/23/14 AN Home Brew Phono Pre - Installed Audio Note Copper Capacitors in the RIAA network. .0028uf and .0082uf in each channel

11/21/14 AN Home Brew Phono Pre - Replaced the six more Allen Bradley resistors (3 per channel) with Takman one watt resistors.

11/28/14 AN Home Brew Phono Pre - Tweeked the voltage in my phono pre. Very good results. Much more open and transparent sound. Orchestral strings sound really nice.

12/6/14 Rega P3-24. I added a Audio Note iQ3 cartridge. Needs about 100 hours of break in.
Rega Exact is a great cartridge but opportunity came up. We'll see which I prefer once the iQ3 is broken in.

12/13/14 WE91a. installed Duelund Copper Cast coupling caps. After two weeks more natural sounding than the V-cap Teflon

1/12/15-Duelund Copper CAST 630v coupler caps have a very natural, emotionally engaging musicality with a very rich and colorful tonal pallet. Keepers for sure!

3/1/15-WE91a - Experimenting with WIMA power supply caps. These are Metallized Polypropylene. C2 in my power supply is a 100uf oil. I have replaced it with a 50uf Wima. I think the 50uf is a better choice as it controls the woofer a bit better.

3/7/15- WE91a - Added new custom built power transformers by Heybour. 250mA. Also added another WIMA cap at C1- its a 15uf.
B+ went from 424 to 450. 375v across the 300b plate. 76mA. With all these changes the amp has better control over the woofer. Punchy bass.

3/25/15 WE91a. Took out the Wima at C1. Made the amp sound harsh. Put it a GE F97 oil.
3/30/15 WE91a. Took out the Solen 12uf Cap on the screen of the 6C6 driver tube and replaced it with a 22uf Black Gate VK cap. The Solen is muddy compared to the Black Gate. I didnt realize how important the cap on the 6C6 screen is to the sound of the amplifier.

4/15/15 WE91a - A friend has lent me four low DCR 2H chokes (two per channel) to try in place of the single 10H Hammond in each channel. PS is now 15uf/1.8H/15uf/2h/50uf. Amp sounds faster and more nimble. Nice.

5/14/15 WE91a. I have bypassed the Wima Cap at C2 in the power supply with four very low value film caps. Too soon to draw any conclusions about sound.
5/31/15 WE91a. New production Audio Note 50uf Kaisei Power supply capacitors have arrived and after a week of burning them in, I have installed them in place of the Wima 50uf and all of those bypass film caps. will see which I like better in a couple of weeks.

6/13/15 WE91a. The New production Audio Note 50uf Kaisei Power supply capacitors have been in my power supply for two weeks - about 100 hours or so of playing time. They have a purity, and a crystal clear clarity that no other cap in the power supply has had. I am going to replace the rest of the PS oils with these to see what happens. Maybe it will be too much- who knows. They dont have too much of a sonic signature. They just sound very free and open so adding a few more may be ok. If not I can put an oil back in.

7/10/15-WE91a. Installed Audio Note Ultra Hi B output transformers today. Will need a few weeks to come around.
9/1/15 - WE91a. The Audio Note Transformers and great with excellent depth and coherence. Added copper shrouds. 
9/25/15 -Western Electric Speaker wire and interconnects. I like the speaker wire better than my Audio Note Lexus copper. More direct. They make the Lexus cable sound soft around the edges and diffuse. The WE Interconnects are very good too. But still learning about there sound.
10/11/15 - WE91a. Took out the 6C6 driver tubes and installed C3m drivers. 

11/28/15 - WE91a. Added Regulation to the Screen of the C3m driver tubes. K&K CCS board and an OD3 glow tube that is puts out 150volts. The C3m driver tube and regulation is an excellent driver of a 300b output tube. Very fast  and dynamic with lots of detail and musicality. I am very happy with the sound of this amp.  Probably not making any more changes for quite a while.

1/1/16 - WE91a I still notice a bit of extra weight in the lower mids so I replaced the last oil cap in the power supply (c-1) with an Audio Note Kaisei 50uf cap.

2/1/16 -WE91a. After adding additional Audio Note Kaisei capacitor to the power supply, the voicing of this amplifier is complete. The power supply is 50uf/5h 30ohm choke/ 50uf and it sounds dynamic fast and clean. With all Kaisei caps in the power supply the lower mids are now more open and that weight I mentioned above is gone. Will rebuild the amp onto a new piece of wood and hide all of the hi voltage parts underneath. Will post pics of the new build as it progresses.

3/10/2016 - WE91a.  New Chassis is finished. The new build features and extremely short signal path and a copper box known as a "faraday cage" which isolates the audio circuit from RF/AC, Cell phones, and other nasty's. The goal here is to eliminate the grid stopping resistors that are usually necessary on many tube grids. In a SET amplifier any extra part effects the sound especially a resistor in series with the grid. They are usually necessary on the C3m grid as well. Without a grid stopper the C3m tube can squeal and make all sorts of other very harmful noises but with my new chassis implementation I have not needed a grid stopper.  If the C3m tubes continue to behave it would be a major step forward. The sound of the amp without a grid stopper is more open free and natural.

4/2/16 - Audio M3 Phono Pre- I had some copper left over from my amp build so I made a 8x6x2 copper box and put the phono circuit inside. Pics added.

5/16- Bought Kondo KSL-LP silver interconnects and am using them with Audio Note Lexus Bi Wire copper speaker cables. After trying various IC's like homebrew WE-16g and Ocellia silver reference and various Speaker cables like WE-16g and 10g and Kondo KSL-SPz, the Kondo KSL-LP silver interconnects with Audio Note Lexus Bi Wire copper speaker cables really bring something special to the table at least to my ears system and room.

9/20/16 Ayon CD07 - put in NOS Raytheon 5687 tubes and after a week of break in they sound tremendous. Transparent mids fast and clean lows and clean extended highs. Better than any tube thus far.

10/2016  WE91a - I removed the 91k bleeder resistor from the last cap in the power supply. I can't believe how much more open, free and transparent the sound is. It's like that bleeder had clamped down on PS and now without it there is more energy coming into the room. Any tonal warmth that had been left in this amp is now gone.

11/2016 WE91a - with the bleeder resistor removed I noticed a tinniness in they high frequencies so I removed the GE 12gauge wire from both the power supply b+ and ground and replaced it with vintage WE 16gauge wire and that tinniness is now completely gone. The WE vintage wire sounds very good just as others have reported.

1/2018 -WE91a. Replaced the Goldpoint 50k stepped attenuator with a Seiden Shunt stepped attenuator loaded with Audio Note tantalum resistors. Its been in for about a month and I am shocked at the change in sound. Extended highs and lows and more lively mids. Huge step up. The highs and mids are so open and beautiful. Powerful bass. A very worthwhile change.

3/2020- WE91a.  Over the past year and one half, experimented with a .22UF Russian vintage cap in the coupling position in place of a duelund .1uf copper cap after growing tired of the  accurate and analytical presentation of the Duelund. The Russian cap did not do anything that I liked even after a year of listening. It was kinda like all the instruments turned the color of grey. I’ve had some Audio Note copper .47uf caps sitting around for a few years so put them in around the first of 2020 so they now have three months on them. 

The AN copper .47uf coupling caps after a two month an up and down ride stopped changing about a month ago. So I’ve been listening for a solid month after they finally settled in.  

I perceive no less detail with them compared to the duelunds but the detail is integrated into a more musical and three dimensional presentation. There are real instruments playing in front of me. Much more texture and dimension. There may be just a bit of glue tying everything together but even with the glue, there is individual instrumental color and tone in spades. A bit more overall warmth and richness.  Keeping in mind that my system has AUDIO NOTE output transformers, speakers, speaker cables, resistors and capacitors, kondo interconnects and an AN IQ lll Cartridge. So I would have thought adding an Audio Note coupling cap would have been to much, but it actually brought everything together in a very nice way.

 I think they might be too much of a good thing in a system that already fills out a three dimensional space but for me they add something lovely and musical that was missing. This reminds me that there is no such thing as the best capacitor or best anything else....

Read more...

Room Details

Dimensions: 25’ × 12’  Medium
Ceiling: 9’


Components Toggle details

    • Audio Note UK Audio Note UK AN-e LX HE
    Fun to listen to speakers that do a nice job with most types of music
    • DIY WE91a
    Very natural sound amp with good pacing. Duelund Copper cast caps. Audio Note Ultra hiB Output Transformers. Very short signal path and power supply wiring.
    • DIY Western Electric WE-91A
    Old breadboard

Comments 326

I agree with you and I found that to be true in my preamp. Thanks for posting how they have changed. I will wait until you feel they have totally settled in.

grannyring

Owner
Grannyring, Tuesday night - the very pure open and crystal clear sound of the AN Kaisei caps has returned.

I am shocked at how much influence the capacitor in the C2 position has over the sound of the amp. Much more than any other passive component in this amp. More than changing the Vcap coupling cap to Duelund. That tells me the design of an amp or pre amp must begin with the power supply. Parts choices here are perhaps the most critical part of the whole amp and not by a small margin -Jet

jetrexpro

Owner
...and now tonight the AN Kaisei caps have turned dark and a bit grainy. They sound like oil caps. I spoke too soon. No fun :(

jetrexpro

Owner
Grannyring,

You can see the picture of the Audio Note Kaisei in my pictures above:DIY WE91a Power Supply pic

The Audio Note Kaisei 50uf/500v capacitors are taking at least 60 hours playing time to finally stop changing their sonic characteristics. One thing I noticed right off the bat was how clean pure and free of grain these caps are. On Day 3 their hi frequencies were crystal clear and pure. Over the next several days the Midrange follow suit. It has taken the full 50-60 hours for the lows to finally catch up with the highs and mids. Now that the capacitors have reached this point I need to wait a few more days to see if they will develop or change any more from where they are now. Keep in mind that my power supply has three caps so the single Kaisei is surrounded by an oil on either side. I will most likely place an order for the additional AN Kaisei caps to finish out my supply. If I feel that I have too much of their sonic signature I can add an oil back in.

At this point I can say that I like Kaisei better than the Wima Poly caps bypassed by film caps. The Wima/bypass stack added richness but also added grain and mud. I was never totally convinced by them. They added color and texture in a way that did not work for me in my system and I alway felt like I heard the plastic in the polys. I am not totally going to dismiss this bypass technique since there are many ways to do this and I only tried one way so someone with more patience and experience may have better results.

At this stage I think that Oil caps sound smooth and rich but lack the crystal clear purity of the Audio Note Kaisei. Kaisei have that richness and musicality while at the same time not adding extra noise and grain. Vintage parts like oil caps and Allen Bradley resistors get the music very much right but can in some situations add some noise.

I am surprised by how much influence this cap has in my amp and I also am learning a great deal from this power supply journey that started 3 months ago. I don't know how much playing time the AN Kaisei cap need to be fully broken in so I'll keep you posted -Jet

jetrexpro

Initial feelings on the AN caps?

grannyring

I am waiting with much interest!

grannyring

Owner
Grannyring,

I have installed new production 50uf/500v Audio Note Kaisei capacitors in the C2 position in my power supply. These have been burning in for a few days at 70v so should be partially broken in.
My previous Wima caps bypassed with four film caps sound big, rich and fast, but they take up a lot of room. Let's see how a single Audio Note cap performs. More in a few days - Jet

jetrexpro

Jet, I have thought the same thing. If not for the fact that I was just floored with the TC caps in my preamp, I would never think of doing anything! Yes, I emailed Larry and he suggested trying D Link. Yes indeed I was going to start with .001 uf. On the bypass bundles.

grannyring

Owner
Grannyring, I was just now reading about your Ultra Fi Monaco 845 SET and it probably sounds so good I wonder how much is to be gained by changing the PS Caps. Have you contacted Larry Moore to ask him what he would recommend?
As far as bypass bundles go, I think you could start with a smaller first value, like .0010 and then work up from there.

jetrexpro

Very true! I have a Ultra Fi Monaco 845 SET amp with a 46 DHT driver and 6sn7 input tube. It is solid state rectified. Each tube has its owner power supply and power tranny. This amp has turned my expectations and past experience with SET amps on its head. I love this amp. Music music sounds so real and intoxicating. Fun!

The only thing left for me to do is replace the electrolytic caps in the B+ supply. I need 330uf of capacitance at 900 Vdc. The 900 volts is making it hard for me to use film caps again. Not enough room.

I contacted Clarity and asked for three 110uf 900vdc TC caps. They state in printed materials that you can order 900vdc options. If I can have these made, then I will have to think about bypass cap bundles on them. .01uf, 1uf, 10 uf....?

I am looking at the Wima DC Link caps, but my past experience with the TC caps was so darn good I may just go back to the same well.

I keep following all you have done to your wonderful amp.

I have to heal up from back surgery before I do this, but I am in the planning process now.

grannyring

Owner
Your math for the bypass sounds very similar to what I am doing. I was instructed to bypass every cap in the PS and every cathode in the audio circuit with this combination of four caps. I have chosen to try this only on C2. I am too lazy and dont want to shell out the $$ for all of those caps to try it elsewhere. I also dont have the space in my amp.

jetrexpro

Yeah, I have had mixed results. Never felt one had to bypass film caps in the power supply. I did not with the Clarity TC and it was magic really. I usually just used bundle values in 100x increments. For example .22uf, 22 uf etc...

grannyring

Owner
Grannyring, My AA friend asked me to honor his request not to share the bundle values. He suggested that you read as much amp design info by Dennis Fraker of Serious Stereo that you can get your hands on. Lots of info about his amp design philosophy online. Thorsten's bundle values should work very well. Thorsten is well respected.

I can tell you that for my system and ears, there is something good about these bypass caps. I was skeptical at first but after several weeks with three of them and six days with all four I like what I am hearing. I think one needs to install all four to get the full impact. Once they have been in for a few more weeks, I'll report back. The Audio Note caps will be here by Tuesday. I'll have to try them at some point but at this moment, I am less motivated. -Jet

jetrexpro

Owner
Grannyring, my AA Tube DIY friend had asked me not divulge the bundle values, but I emailed him to ask his permission to share. Thorsten Loesch's Legacy 300b amp uses Ansar Supersound Polypropylen Capcitors extensively used throughout the Amplifier and his bundle choices are here. This is from the website:

"All capacitors feature the complete recommended bypassing with 3600pF ERO KP1832, 2700pF NFS Styrofoam and a further 2200pF Silver Mica unit. Larger Value capacitors have a further ERO KP1832 0.075uF 800V bypass capacitors."

jetrexpro

Jet, can you share the bypass cap values used on your bypass bundles. I have also used bundled bypass caps in the past, but just sort of guessed at the values.

grannyring

Owner
I uploaded a picture of one channel of the WE91a power supply if any of you are interested in seeing the red Wima cap surrounded by the four bypass caps, LOL!

"DIY WE91a Power Supply pic"

Not enough space to make these additions neat and clean. It would have to sound really amazing for me to want to figure out a way to use these long term.

jetrexpro

Owner
Grannyring, The Audio Note electrolytic caps should arrive very soon and I'll report back in a few weeks or so on their sound. I'll live with the polys bypassed by film caps for a while first. Actually polys bypassed by film caps are sounding pretty good so far :) All these caps take up an a lot of space and some time to settle in before there sound stops changing.

jetrexpro

Owner
Charles, The Coincident guys probably did all the trial and errors years ago that I am doing now and they have an amp that most think is one of the top 300b amps around. I'm in a learning phase mostly about power supplies at this time. Before giving up on polypropylene caps I am in the processing of bypassing them with film caps. Although it makes me wonder what my amp wound sound like if I started with polyprops in the PS and then voiced the circuit around those. They are very fast hi bandwidth caps.

Dan, Thank you for the tip about terminating the shield at the power source. Much appreciated!

jetrexpro

Please report back on those new AN electrolytic caps as I may need to use them in another project where the large can Clarity TC cusps won't fit. I have been looking at them!

grannyring

Hello Jet,

I was evaluating the sound of my Class D amps, and I realized there was a fairly significant hum coming from them I hadn't noticed before.

I realized I probably did need to ground one end of the shielding on the Belden power cords. The shielding was acting as an antenna, as it is prone to do.

Yesterday, I grounded the end at the power source on both cables, and it did the trick. Knowing you, you were probably going to do it right the first time. I was just being lazy, in a sense.

Regards,
Dan

islandmandan

Jet,
It makes sense to me that Blackgates would work optimally given the makeup of your system. Voicing of components via certain parts to get a desired sound or synergy is common practice. By the same token, using those same black gate capacitors in my amplifier could yield better, worse or just simply different sonic results.
Charles,

charles1dad

Owner
Charles, I've seen many many amps and preamps including yours that use polypropylene caps so it is distressing that I don't favor their sound (at least in this application). Yes sometimes its fun but it can be distressing when my ears tell me something that goes against the standard HI FI cannon. And some of this may be because my Audio Note Speakers sound a certain way and I may simply find that the more Black Gate caps I use in this amp the better it sounds with Audio Note Speakers. After all the hi end Audio Note amps are filled with Black Gates and so far everytime I put a BG cap in my amp I like the sound better than before.

I am guessing that most polypropylene caps would sound better than most any standard electrolytic cap. Most builders of hi end gear shun electrolytic caps but Black Gate caps are not your standard electrolytic. BG's contain graphite. I am hoping that the Audio Note caps sound close to how BG's sound or I can go back to the oils.

jetrexpro

Hi Jet,
I suspect I'd like the sound of a good oil cap power supply. You're doing this the right way by relying on your ears and simply listening. I'd assume that a polypropylene cap sounds better than an electrolytic, but I could certainly be wrong. Some electrolytics may be better than others and Audio Note may be in that category. My amp has power supply polypropylene caps and sounds very organic and real IMO(built to utilize these caps from the beginning so this is likely a major factor for the good result). I do realize that much depends on part quality, design and implementation. It must be fun and satisfying to experiment and listen to the different sonic contributions of these various parts. With this approach you're able to get just the right sound that you desire.
Charles,

charles1dad

Owner
Charles, The control over dynamics, coherence and the ebb and flow of especially large scale orchestral music is impressive. It seems to turn on a dime to handle loud and soft passages with a sudden response. It does make the music more expressive. I'm kinda shocked at the speed and dynamic expression. Better than the original supply for sure.

On the other hand I am finding that I don't like the sound of Wima Polypropylene Caps in the power supply. When I began this power supply learning experience, I replaced oils in the power supply with these Wima Polypropylene caps. I know many others including Grannyring have had success with Polypropylene caps but they are made of plastic and I find that I hear the plastic in the sound. Oil/Paper caps sound more natural to my ears. I haven't totally given up on Polypropylene but I have ordered the new Audio Note Kaisei Electrolytic Capacitors just in case. They should arrive along with my Audio Note Ultra Hi B output transformers next week.

Oil caps in the power supply sound sweet and smooth to my ears. Warm and friendly and now my amp is missing that sweetness. If the AN Electrolytic caps don't sound sweet I'll go back to oils but will order a 50uf to match the value of the Poly cap. I have some faith in Audio Note since they have relied on the now discontinued Black Gate Caps for years and their new electrolytics are hopefully building upon BG technology. This has been a real journey in which I have learned a lot. It's a real balance trying to get everything to work just right -Jet

jetrexpro

Jet,
Your music must sound utterly natural and emotionally involving given the choices you have made in developing your system.
Charles,

charles1dad

Showing 126 - 150 of 326 posts